JPS6030504A - Cold rolling method by different peripheral speeds - Google Patents

Cold rolling method by different peripheral speeds

Info

Publication number
JPS6030504A
JPS6030504A JP13777683A JP13777683A JPS6030504A JP S6030504 A JPS6030504 A JP S6030504A JP 13777683 A JP13777683 A JP 13777683A JP 13777683 A JP13777683 A JP 13777683A JP S6030504 A JPS6030504 A JP S6030504A
Authority
JP
Japan
Prior art keywords
rolling
lubricant
cold rolling
oil
peripheral speeds
Prior art date
Legal status (The legal status is an assumption and is not a legal conclusion. Google has not performed a legal analysis and makes no representation as to the accuracy of the status listed.)
Pending
Application number
JP13777683A
Other languages
Japanese (ja)
Inventor
Hiroshi Kuwamoto
鍬本 紘
Yoichi Nakanishi
洋一 中西
Yuji Okami
岡見 雄二
Kazuo Toguchi
戸口 一男
Haruji Toyama
外山 晴二
Nobuomi Kuroi
黒井 信臣
Current Assignee (The listed assignees may be inaccurate. Google has not performed a legal analysis and makes no representation or warranty as to the accuracy of the list.)
Yushiro do Brasil Industria Quimica Ltda
Yushiro Chemical Industry Co Ltd
JFE Engineering Corp
Original Assignee
Yushiro do Brasil Industria Quimica Ltda
Yushiro Chemical Industry Co Ltd
NKK Corp
Nippon Kokan Ltd
Priority date (The priority date is an assumption and is not a legal conclusion. Google has not performed a legal analysis and makes no representation as to the accuracy of the date listed.)
Filing date
Publication date
Application filed by Yushiro do Brasil Industria Quimica Ltda, Yushiro Chemical Industry Co Ltd, NKK Corp, Nippon Kokan Ltd filed Critical Yushiro do Brasil Industria Quimica Ltda
Priority to JP13777683A priority Critical patent/JPS6030504A/en
Publication of JPS6030504A publication Critical patent/JPS6030504A/en
Pending legal-status Critical Current

Links

Classifications

    • BPERFORMING OPERATIONS; TRANSPORTING
    • B21MECHANICAL METAL-WORKING WITHOUT ESSENTIALLY REMOVING MATERIAL; PUNCHING METAL
    • B21BROLLING OF METAL
    • B21B45/00Devices for surface or other treatment of work, specially combined with or arranged in, or specially adapted for use in connection with, metal-rolling mills
    • B21B45/02Devices for surface or other treatment of work, specially combined with or arranged in, or specially adapted for use in connection with, metal-rolling mills for lubricating, cooling, or cleaning
    • B21B45/0239Lubricating
    • B21B45/0242Lubricants
    • BPERFORMING OPERATIONS; TRANSPORTING
    • B21MECHANICAL METAL-WORKING WITHOUT ESSENTIALLY REMOVING MATERIAL; PUNCHING METAL
    • B21BROLLING OF METAL
    • B21B1/00Metal-rolling methods or mills for making semi-finished products of solid or profiled cross-section; Sequence of operations in milling trains; Layout of rolling-mill plant, e.g. grouping of stands; Succession of passes or of sectional pass alternations
    • B21B1/22Metal-rolling methods or mills for making semi-finished products of solid or profiled cross-section; Sequence of operations in milling trains; Layout of rolling-mill plant, e.g. grouping of stands; Succession of passes or of sectional pass alternations for rolling plates, strips, bands or sheets of indefinite length
    • B21B1/24Metal-rolling methods or mills for making semi-finished products of solid or profiled cross-section; Sequence of operations in milling trains; Layout of rolling-mill plant, e.g. grouping of stands; Succession of passes or of sectional pass alternations for rolling plates, strips, bands or sheets of indefinite length in a continuous or semi-continuous process
    • B21B1/28Metal-rolling methods or mills for making semi-finished products of solid or profiled cross-section; Sequence of operations in milling trains; Layout of rolling-mill plant, e.g. grouping of stands; Succession of passes or of sectional pass alternations for rolling plates, strips, bands or sheets of indefinite length in a continuous or semi-continuous process by cold-rolling, e.g. Steckel cold mill
    • BPERFORMING OPERATIONS; TRANSPORTING
    • B21MECHANICAL METAL-WORKING WITHOUT ESSENTIALLY REMOVING MATERIAL; PUNCHING METAL
    • B21BROLLING OF METAL
    • B21B1/00Metal-rolling methods or mills for making semi-finished products of solid or profiled cross-section; Sequence of operations in milling trains; Layout of rolling-mill plant, e.g. grouping of stands; Succession of passes or of sectional pass alternations
    • B21B1/22Metal-rolling methods or mills for making semi-finished products of solid or profiled cross-section; Sequence of operations in milling trains; Layout of rolling-mill plant, e.g. grouping of stands; Succession of passes or of sectional pass alternations for rolling plates, strips, bands or sheets of indefinite length
    • B21B1/30Metal-rolling methods or mills for making semi-finished products of solid or profiled cross-section; Sequence of operations in milling trains; Layout of rolling-mill plant, e.g. grouping of stands; Succession of passes or of sectional pass alternations for rolling plates, strips, bands or sheets of indefinite length in a non-continuous process
    • B21B1/32Metal-rolling methods or mills for making semi-finished products of solid or profiled cross-section; Sequence of operations in milling trains; Layout of rolling-mill plant, e.g. grouping of stands; Succession of passes or of sectional pass alternations for rolling plates, strips, bands or sheets of indefinite length in a non-continuous process in reversing single stand mills, e.g. with intermediate storage reels for accumulating work
    • B21B1/36Metal-rolling methods or mills for making semi-finished products of solid or profiled cross-section; Sequence of operations in milling trains; Layout of rolling-mill plant, e.g. grouping of stands; Succession of passes or of sectional pass alternations for rolling plates, strips, bands or sheets of indefinite length in a non-continuous process in reversing single stand mills, e.g. with intermediate storage reels for accumulating work by cold-rolling
    • BPERFORMING OPERATIONS; TRANSPORTING
    • B21MECHANICAL METAL-WORKING WITHOUT ESSENTIALLY REMOVING MATERIAL; PUNCHING METAL
    • B21BROLLING OF METAL
    • B21B2275/00Mill drive parameters
    • B21B2275/02Speed
    • B21B2275/04Roll speed
    • B21B2275/05Speed difference between top and bottom rolls
    • BPERFORMING OPERATIONS; TRANSPORTING
    • B21MECHANICAL METAL-WORKING WITHOUT ESSENTIALLY REMOVING MATERIAL; PUNCHING METAL
    • B21BROLLING OF METAL
    • B21B45/00Devices for surface or other treatment of work, specially combined with or arranged in, or specially adapted for use in connection with, metal-rolling mills
    • B21B45/02Devices for surface or other treatment of work, specially combined with or arranged in, or specially adapted for use in connection with, metal-rolling mills for lubricating, cooling, or cleaning
    • B21B45/0239Lubricating
    • B21B45/0245Lubricating devices
    • B21B45/0248Lubricating devices using liquid lubricants, e.g. for sections, for tubes
    • B21B45/0251Lubricating devices using liquid lubricants, e.g. for sections, for tubes for strips, sheets, or plates

Landscapes

  • Engineering & Computer Science (AREA)
  • Mechanical Engineering (AREA)
  • Metal Rolling (AREA)
  • Lubricants (AREA)

Abstract

PURPOSE:To improve slip-resisting property and to prevent the generation of a surface defect called friction pickup by using in rolling, an aqueous dispersion liquid of rolling lubricant, prepared by mixing an organic phosphate of prescribed rate in a lubricant having prescribed viscosity. CONSTITUTION:An rolling lubricant is prepared, which contains a >=50wt% mineral oil and a 0.1-10wt% (with respect to a lubricant) organic phosphate (dipolyoxyalkyl phosphate). A cold rolling by different peripheral speeds at >=1.03 the ratio between different peripheral speeds, is performed by using an aqueous dispersion liquid containing a 2-20wt% said lubricant.

Description

【発明の詳細な説明】 本・発明は、異周速圧延の際に使用する圧延油剤の水分
散液にかかるものであり、通常の等速圧延に比較して異
った圧延挙動を行う異周速圧延作業に、おいてその作業
を安定して行うことの可能な圧延油剤の水分散液を提供
するものである。
DETAILED DESCRIPTION OF THE INVENTION The present invention relates to an aqueous dispersion of rolling oil used in different circumferential speed rolling, and involves rolling behavior that is different from normal uniform speed rolling. An object of the present invention is to provide an aqueous dispersion of a rolling oil agent that can stably perform circumferential speed rolling operations.

異周速圧延方式は、その圧延機前からみても明らかなよ
うに等速圧延方式によって得られるのと同じ効果を低圧
で得ることができ、従ってこの方式で圧延荷重を上げれ
ば結果的に等速圧延における高圧下の圧延と同じ効果が
得られ易くなシ、省エネルギー、圧延作業の高能車化に
寄与する面が大であシながら、実際にはスリップが起り
やすい、フリクションピックアップを生じやすいなどの
問題があって圧延作業のコントロールがしにくいという
欠点があった。
As is clear from the front view of the rolling mill, the variable circumferential speed rolling method can achieve the same effect as the constant speed rolling method at a lower pressure, so if the rolling load is increased with this method, the result will be the same. Although it is not easy to obtain the same effects as rolling under high pressure in high-speed rolling, and it greatly contributes to energy saving and high-performance rolling operations, in reality slips are more likely to occur, friction pickup is more likely to occur, etc. There was a problem that it was difficult to control the rolling operation.

本発明者らは、異周速圧延作業中における前掲の諸問題
点を使用する圧延油によって調整することができるのか
否かにつき予備的手段としてテストミルを用いて検討を
行った。
The present inventors conducted a study using a test mill as a preliminary means to determine whether the above-mentioned problems during rolling at different circumferential speeds can be adjusted by the rolling oil used.

異周速圧延においては、その中立点が低速ロール側では
板の入口側に移動し、高速ロール側では板の出口側に移
動する。そして具間速比が大きくなるに従って、前述の
移動量は大きくなり、ついには高速側で接触弧内から逸
脱し板とロール間でスリップを生じ圧延作業が不安定と
なる。
In different circumferential speed rolling, the neutral point moves toward the inlet side of the plate on the low-speed roll side, and moves to the outlet side of the plate on the high-speed roll side. As the inter-tool speed ratio increases, the above-mentioned movement amount increases, and eventually the plate deviates from the contact arc on the high speed side, causing slip between the plate and the roll, making the rolling operation unstable.

この中立点の移動は、異同速比によるばかシではなく供
給される圧延油の灼滑性能にも影響される。
This movement of the neutral point is not affected by the different speed ratios, but is also affected by the sintering performance of the supplied rolling oil.

テストミルによるn周速圧延の具体的な検討から、一般
的に潤滑性がすぐれているといわれている牛脂系圧延油
でU4、中立点の移動量が大きく接触弧より逸脱してス
リップを生じゃすい。このような牛脂系圧延油に比較し
潤滑性が劣ると考えられている鉱油系圧延油はスリップ
しに〈〈異周速冷間圧延にめられるスリップ防止性能を
発揮し得るこ゛とを究めた。
From a specific study of n-peripheral speed rolling using a test mill, we found that U4, which is generally said to have excellent lubricity, has a large neutral point movement distance that deviates from the contact arc and causes slip. water. Mineral oil-based rolling oil, which is considered to have inferior lubricity compared to beef tallow-based rolling oil, has been found to be capable of exhibiting the slip-preventing performance required in cold rolling at different circumferential speeds.

さらに検討を加えた結果、使用する鉱油の粘度が極めて
性能に大きな影響を与えることが確認され、粘度が低す
ぎる鉱油の場合ではロールバイトへ引き込まれる油量が
少なくなることや油膜強度が不足するため潤滑性が劣り
圧延荷重が高くなることが明らかとなった。
As a result of further investigation, it was confirmed that the viscosity of the mineral oil used has an extremely large effect on performance, and if the viscosity of mineral oil is too low, the amount of oil drawn into the roll bit will be small and the oil film strength will be insufficient. It became clear that this resulted in poor lubricity and increased rolling load.

また、異周速圧延では、高速ロール側のロール板の相対
すベシ距離が従来の等速圧延に比較して長くなル、この
ため7リクシヨンピツクアツプ(以下F Pと略記する
ことがある)と呼ばれる表面欠陥の現象を生じやすい。
In addition, in different circumferential speed rolling, the distance between the roll plates on the high-speed roll side is longer than that in conventional constant speed rolling, so 7-pull pick-up (hereinafter sometimes abbreviated as FP) is used. It is easy to cause a phenomenon called surface defects.

このフリクションピンクアップ生成の原因ないしけ生成
過程については、−未だつまびらかKはしていないが、
その板木現象は摩擦による局部的な過熱焼付き現象と考
えられる。
As for the cause of this friction pink-up generation and the process of friction generation, - although I have not yet determined the cause of the friction pink-up generation,
The wood board phenomenon is considered to be a localized overheating seizure phenomenon caused by friction.

従って7リクシヨンピツクアツプを防ぐためには、圧延
油剤が被覆されて形成する油膜の強度の大きいものを使
用することが先決であろう。
Therefore, in order to prevent the 7-reaction pickup, it is best to use a rolling oil coated with a strong oil film that forms.

このような目的のために使用する圧延油剤のうちの潤滑
成分について考慮すると、牛脂などの油脂成分を使用し
た方が大きな油膜強度を期待できるという効果はめるが
、前述のように8E延作業時に中立点が板の出口側に移
動しやすくこのため相対スベリ距離が長くなって7リク
シヨンビツクアツプ防止効果は小さい。
When considering the lubricating components of the rolling oil used for this purpose, it can be expected that greater oil film strength can be expected by using oil components such as beef tallow, but as mentioned above, it is possible to expect a greater oil film strength during 8E rolling work. The point tends to move toward the exit side of the plate, so the relative slip distance becomes long, and the effect of preventing the 7-reaction pickup is small.

本発明者らは、前述のような鉱油を用いて適度ノ耐スリ
ップ性を有しかつ7リククヨンビツクアツプを生じさせ
ない方法について種々検討を加え特定の添加剤を併用す
ることにょシ、目的とする潤滑性能を有する圧延油剤を
形成することを知り本発明に到達したのである。
The inventors of the present invention have conducted various studies on a method using mineral oil as described above to have a suitable level of slip resistance and do not cause leakage pickup, and have decided to use a specific additive in combination. The present invention was achieved by finding out that it is possible to form a rolling oil having lubricating properties as follows.

すなわち本発明は、異同速比1.06以上の異周速冷間
圧延を行うにるたシ、潤滑剤成分中に鉱油を50MN%
以上を含有しかつ50℃で」11定した粘度が10セン
チストークス以上である潤滑剤と該潤滑剤の0.1〜1
0重i:チの有機リン酸エステルを必須成分として含有
する圧延油剤の2〜20重量%水分散液を用いて圧延す
ることを特徴とする異周速冷間圧延方法に関するもので
ある。
That is, the present invention is a Nirutashi machine that performs cold rolling at different circumferential speeds with a different speed ratio of 1.06 or more, and a lubricant containing 50 MN% of mineral oil.
A lubricant containing the above and having a constant viscosity of 10 centistokes or more at 50°C and 0.1 to 1
The present invention relates to a cold rolling method at different circumferential speeds, characterized in that rolling is carried out using a 2 to 20% by weight aqueous dispersion of a rolling oil containing an organic phosphoric acid ester of 0 weight i:h as an essential component.

ここで使用する有機リン酸エステルとは、ホスフェート
、ホスファイト、ホスホネートのいずれであっても有効
でるるか、フリクションピックアップ防止機能のすぐれ
ている化合物は、ジアルキル(Cmへ(J2 )のホス
フェート、ボスファイト、ホスホネートである。特にジ
アルキルホスフェートは、他の化合物に比べて水中で加
水分解しにくいので使いやすぐ、さらにポリオキシエチ
レン基を有するジアルキルホスフェートは乳化性がある
ので最も使用しやすい化合物の代表例である。この場合
のオキシエチレン基の付加モル数は概ね1〜8のものが
望ましく9以上になると分子中のリン含有量が相対的に
低下しかつ親水性が強くなりすぎるので好ましくない。
The organic phosphate ester used here is phosphate, phosphite, or phosphonate. Compounds that are effective in preventing friction pickup are dialkyl (Cm to (J2) phosphate, boss In particular, dialkyl phosphates are easy to use because they are difficult to hydrolyze in water compared to other compounds, and dialkyl phosphates with polyoxyethylene groups have emulsifying properties, so they are representative of the compounds that are easiest to use. This is an example. In this case, the number of moles of oxyethylene groups added is preferably approximately 1 to 8. If the number is 9 or more, the phosphorus content in the molecule becomes relatively low and the hydrophilicity becomes too strong, which is not preferable.

リン酸エステルの使用かは、o、i、@量チ未満でハ、
フリクションピックアップ防止機能は十分に現れずまた
10重窟゛チ以上ではスリップを起しゃすくなり好まし
くない。
Whether to use phosphoric acid ester, o, i, @ amount less than c,
The friction pickup prevention function is not sufficiently exhibited, and if the friction pick-up is more than 10 times, slipping is likely to occur, which is undesirable.

また本発明では潤滑剤成分中に50重l#チ以上の鉱油
が含まれていることが盛装で、この址が少ないとスリッ
プが生じゃすくなる。
Furthermore, in the present invention, it is important that the lubricant component contains at least 50 l/w of mineral oil, and if this amount is small, slippage is likely to occur.

潤滑剤成分の他のものとしては、牛脂、パーム油などの
油脂、ブチルパルミテートなどのエステル油、オレイン
酸などの脂肪、ポリブテンなどの合成潤滑油のような群
から選ばれる1種・または2種以上のものが挙げられる
が、圧延中のスリップ防止の観点からみた場合では油脂
類は60重量%以下、エステル油は45重量−以下、脂
肪酸は10重匁チ以下とすることが好ましい。
Other lubricant components include one or two selected from the group of fats and oils such as beef tallow and palm oil, ester oils such as butyl palmitate, fats such as oleic acid, and synthetic lubricating oils such as polybutene. From the viewpoint of preventing slippage during rolling, it is preferable that the amount of oils and fats be 60% by weight or less, the ester oil be 45% by weight or less, and the fatty acid be 10% by weight or less.

さらに、上述の如き成分からなる鈎滑剤の粘度にも制限
があシ、50℃で測定した値が10センチストークス未
満であると7リクシヨンピツクアツプ防止性能が不充分
となるし、一方500センチストークス以上の粘度とな
るとスリップを生ずるおそれがメジ、従って粘度は10
〜500センチストークスの間のものを使用するのが望
ましい。
Furthermore, there is a limit to the viscosity of the hook lubricant made of the above-mentioned components; if the value measured at 50°C is less than 10 centistokes, the 7-reaction pick-up prevention performance will be insufficient; If the viscosity is higher than that, there is a serious risk of slipping, so the viscosity is 10
It is preferable to use between ~500 centistokes.

以上述べた如き必須構成要件を満足したのちは、公知の
他の成分、例えば乳化剤は従来の圧延油に使用されてい
るものを使用してよく、その乳化程度も通常の圧延油の
乳化程度で良い。
After satisfying the essential constituent requirements as described above, other known components such as emulsifiers used in conventional rolling oil may be used, and the degree of emulsification is similar to that of ordinary rolling oil. good.

また、狗渭剤ないしは圧延油剤中には、必要に応じて各
種の添加剤例えば酸化防止剤、防錆剤などを必要量添加
することが可能であることはいうまで本ない。
It goes without saying that it is possible to add various additives such as antioxidants, rust preventives, etc. in required amounts to the rolling agent or rolling oil, if necessary.

以下実施例によってさらに本発明を説明する。The present invention will be further explained below with reference to Examples.

実施例 試験用圧延機を用いろ水準の異同速比の条件下での冷間
圧延を行うと共に比較のため等速圧延を行って圧延油剤
の耐スリップ性、耐FP性を評価した。具体的条件は次
の通りである。
EXAMPLE Cold rolling was carried out using a test rolling mill under conditions of different and same speed ratios, and uniform speed rolling was also carried out for comparison to evaluate the slip resistance and FP resistance of the rolling oil. The specific conditions are as follows.

圧下車:40チ、 供試材:5pcc−8B圧延油剤:
濃度5重量%、温度50℃、流量2・3V分 一覧表に示した通シ異周速圧延においては、圧延荷重が
等速圧延に比較して大幅に低下することか認められ、本
発明に従って構成した圧延油剤を使用することKよシ耐
スリップ性、耐FP性に優れた性能を期待することがで
きる。
Rolling car: 40 inches, Test material: 5pcc-8B rolling oil:
In the through-circumferential speed rolling shown in the table at a concentration of 5% by weight, a temperature of 50°C, and a flow rate of 2.3V, it is recognized that the rolling load is significantly reduced compared to uniform speed rolling, and according to the present invention, By using the rolling oil as described above, excellent performance in slip resistance and FP resistance can be expected.

一方、比較例に示すように鉱油含有針が少ない場合(実
験番号Z8および10)では耐スリップ性が劣シ、また
潤滑成分の粘度が低すぎる(回、6)ときには圧延荷重
が高く耐FP性が不十分であるし、リン酸エステルを含
有しない場合(同、8)あるいは含有量の少ない場合(
同、9)では11FP性が不十分であることが認められ
る。
On the other hand, as shown in the comparative example, when the number of needles containing mineral oil is small (experiment numbers Z8 and 10), the slip resistance is poor, and when the viscosity of the lubricating component is too low (times, 6), the rolling load is high and the FP resistance is poor. is insufficient, and if it does not contain phosphoric acid ester (ibid., 8) or if the content is small (
9), it is recognized that the 11FP property is insufficient.

第1頁の続きContinuation of page 1

Claims (3)

【特許請求の範囲】[Claims] (1) 異同速比1.03以上の異周速冷間圧延を行う
にあたシ、潤滑剤成分中に鉱油を50重景チ以上を含有
しかつ50℃で測定した粘度が10センチストークス以
上である潤滑剤と該潤滑剤の0.1〜10重−JFl′
%の有機リン酸゛エステルを必須成分として含有する圧
延油剤の2〜20重量%水分散液を用いて圧延すること
を特徴とする異周速冷間圧延方法。
(1) When performing cold rolling at different circumferential speeds with a different speed ratio of 1.03 or more, the lubricant must contain mineral oil in an amount of 50 centistokes or more and have a viscosity of 10 centistokes when measured at 50°C. The lubricant which is above and 0.1 to 10 weight of the lubricant -JFl'
% of organic phosphoric acid ester as an essential component.
(2)50℃での粘度測定値が10〜500センチスト
ークスである鉱油を使用する特許請求の範囲第1項記載
の界周速冷間圧延方法。
(2) The circumferential speed cold rolling method according to claim 1, which uses mineral oil having a measured viscosity of 10 to 500 centistokes at 50°C.
(3) 有機リン酸エステルがジポリオキシアルキルリ
ン酸エステルである特許請求の範囲第1項記載。 の異周速冷間圧延方法。
(3) Claim 1, wherein the organic phosphoric acid ester is a dipolyoxyalkyl phosphoric acid ester. Different circumferential speed cold rolling method.
JP13777683A 1983-07-29 1983-07-29 Cold rolling method by different peripheral speeds Pending JPS6030504A (en)

Priority Applications (1)

Application Number Priority Date Filing Date Title
JP13777683A JPS6030504A (en) 1983-07-29 1983-07-29 Cold rolling method by different peripheral speeds

Applications Claiming Priority (1)

Application Number Priority Date Filing Date Title
JP13777683A JPS6030504A (en) 1983-07-29 1983-07-29 Cold rolling method by different peripheral speeds

Publications (1)

Publication Number Publication Date
JPS6030504A true JPS6030504A (en) 1985-02-16

Family

ID=15206568

Family Applications (1)

Application Number Title Priority Date Filing Date
JP13777683A Pending JPS6030504A (en) 1983-07-29 1983-07-29 Cold rolling method by different peripheral speeds

Country Status (1)

Country Link
JP (1) JPS6030504A (en)

Cited By (2)

* Cited by examiner, † Cited by third party
Publication number Priority date Publication date Assignee Title
JPH0240325U (en) * 1988-09-07 1990-03-19
JPH10273688A (en) * 1997-03-28 1998-10-13 Kyodo Yushi Kk Water-soluble cold rolling oil agent for stainless steel plate and rolling

Cited By (3)

* Cited by examiner, † Cited by third party
Publication number Priority date Publication date Assignee Title
JPH0240325U (en) * 1988-09-07 1990-03-19
JPH0445649Y2 (en) * 1988-09-07 1992-10-27
JPH10273688A (en) * 1997-03-28 1998-10-13 Kyodo Yushi Kk Water-soluble cold rolling oil agent for stainless steel plate and rolling

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